John O'Conner's Blog

Java SE 6 on Mac OS X

Comments

• I really do wish that Sun would take ownership of Java on MacOS X. I realize that Apple has customized the VM to suit their UI style and other ideas, but utlimately, it is Sun who we look for a releasing the JDK. If they can make it work on other OS's they don't influence/control, why not MacOS X?

  Posted by: tegbains on November 30, 2006 at 11:25 PM

• Even if anyone did know, they wouldn't say so here:

  Warning: Pre–release software is Apple confidential information. Your unauthorized distribution of pre–release software or disclosure of information relating to pre–release software (including the posting of screen shots) may subject you to both civil and criminal liability and result in immediate termination of your ADC Membership.
  

  Posted by: goron on November 30, 2006 at 11:31 PM

• I really do wish that Sun would take ownership of Java on MacOS X.

  They won't. But when all the source becomes available in terms of the GPL in a few month you can port it by yourself to OS X. You wouldn't have the Aqua GUI but X11 instead but you could release as often as you like.. :-)
  

  Posted by: konz on December 01, 2006 at 12:40 AM

• I suspect there are even less people using bleeding edge Sun VMs than there are Mac users, so Apple lagging a bit behind doesn't really matter that much.

  Where I work, we're still on 1.4.2 because only now with 1.5.0_10 has the Java 5 JRE become stable and bug-free enough for us to use, with most of the bugs being in the Windows-specific parts (GDI handle disposal from Font being a big one).

  But at least in Mac world, everyone has a somewhat modern JRE preinstalled, so you don't have to ship a whole JRE with every java desktop app.

  I agree with the spirit of the poster though that the needs of the geek are not really met by the Mac java platform.

  Posted by: goron on December 01, 2006 at 03:33 AM

• The latest build # from Sun is 104...from Apple, it's 88.It's never easy to read Apple's actions. Java SE was supposed to be final by now, so Apple may well be waiting for a final drop to build their version from, rather than build a throw-away DP for the time between now and when they can get their final JDK 6 out. It does bring up one of those interesting questions, though: is Apple Java primarily targeted at developers or end-users? There are enough Java developers, Apple could probably justify their Java development solely on keeping Java developers buying MacBooks, regardless of any Java end-user audience on the platform.I really do wish that Sun would take ownership of Java on Mac OS XBe careful what you wish for. Back around 1996-7, Sun did a JDK 1.0 for the Mac and it was a total non-effort. They seemed very happy to hand over to third parties making Mac JVM's: Metrowerks (their VM later licensed by Microsoft for Mac IE), Roaster (RIP), and later Apple. Sun did loan a few engineers to Apple until Sun had a big layoff; since then it's been an all-Apple effort. Still, it's a tricky situation: Mac isn't necessarily a priority for Sun, and Java's not necessarily a priority for Apple.Also, too bad the iPod's a closed platform: it would be interesting to know if those new games are Java ME or something else.

  Posted by: invalidname on December 01, 2006 at 03:39 AM

• I agree that Sun should take over on Mac. But it may have to be a community thing at first (once the class libraries are available). Mozilla releases Firefox for Mac. I suspect people are willing to put in the effort to get Carbon AWT delegates, but it might take a year or three. Now, I'm less optimistic about a community-built PowerPC JIT engine. And I'm on PowerPC myself. Oh well. Still, even if everyone else has to build it, maybe Sun can eventually take over the distribution and finally catch up with Mozilla.

  Posted by: tompalmer on December 01, 2006 at 08:04 AM

• It would certainly be nice if Apple followed Sun's Java releases closer. It's not just about bleeding edge pre-release builds of Java 6 - production versions are now at not-so-fresh 1.5.0_06 and 1.4.2_09. Java 1.3 was never ported to Intel, which is kind of understandable since it will be soon EOL's with Java 6 going live.

  OTOH, I'm glad that Java 6 is being made available for OS 10.4. JRE-OS version dependencies were quite limiting so far, for Java 5 one needs Tiger, no luck with Panther etc. I was afraid that ver. 6 would require Leopard!

  I did ask Apple via ADC about their Java 6 plans and open sourcing - response was a pre-cooked text saying that they won't comment on upcoming products, whether they exist or not...

  I believe Apple's Java offering is quite solid, considering the fact that it's not directly supported by Sun. Other "exotic" platforms are likely in a similar, or worse situation.

  Posted by: miu on December 01, 2006 at 12:44 PM

• Is your Mac Intel-based? If so, just install Ubuntu and you'll be fine :-)

  http://www.petebarrwatson.com/archives/2006/07/ubuntu_macbook.html
  

  Posted by: cayhorstmann on December 01, 2006 at 04:01 PM

• It might also be possible that Apple is holding off any more JDK 6.0 updates until the next version of OSX is released - that should only be a few months away. I think they did something similar with 10.3 and JDK 5.0 - released developer previews, but only 10.4 got the release version.

  Posted by: wmeissner on December 02, 2006 at 12:23 AM

• Gotta love the "write once run everywhere" quote...

  Posted by: sord on December 03, 2006 at 03:22 AM

• new developer previews just came down the pipe (almost like Apple was reading this thread :) ).

  you need the free Apple Developer Connection account to get them.

  and,as per usual, they are NDA'ed

  http://lists.apple.com/archives/Java-dev/2006/Dec/msg00004.html

  Posted by: ga24 on December 03, 2006 at 02:16 PM

• Haha, wow, no way that's a coincedence. They MUST have done that as a response to this thread. Good on them. Anyone know what build it's based on?

  Posted by: benloud on December 03, 2006 at 07:52 PM

• Although I'd love to believe someone from Apple read and responded to this blog by posting the updates to JDK 1.5, I think it's probably coincidence. The updates are for 1.4 and 1.5-based JDKs. Unfortunately, the Java SE 6 status remains the same...no updates.

  Posted by: joconner on December 04, 2006 at 12:55 AM

• It is a coincidence, release notes for this OS 10.4 update are dated Nov. 28 and a similar update for OS 10.3 was released some days ago. These are still "just" first Dev. Previews - normally it takes a few months to reach a production release.

  Surprisingly, JDK 1.5.0 "only" gets updated to _07, 1.4.2 is a little "better" at _12. Well, it's good that *something* is happening...

  Posted by: miu on December 04, 2006 at 07:15 AM

• Final Java 6 is out now - build number is 105. Let's see how long it will take Apple to release their update. I surely hope it's coming for Tiger, well before Leopard ships!

  Posted by: miu on December 11, 2006 at 11:12 AM

• I do hope the same: i recently switch to mac-osx, and i'm developing a java6 based project. it'd be far better to depend on the stable release of mustang!

  Posted by: ervalerio on December 17, 2006 at 06:32 AM

• I remember IGN's old Mac page mac.ign.com, a Mac games site. It's technically still there, but I still say "old", because the newest articles on it are dated 2004 or so. I don't care if my Mac doesn't run games. I have Nintendo, Sony and Microsoft (yes, there are some things they can do well - this is it) for my gaming. That way, I can lean back in my couch, too. But, I do not want to see the OSX Java programmer go the way of the Mac gamer, and hope Apple keeps Java alive on the Mac.

  Posted by: valstadsve on December 18, 2006 at 02:17 PM

• Last week the download was still available. They appear to have pulled it since then. It's amazing how can one love the product (Mac OS X) yet have very mixed emotions about their creator (Apple) and their schemes.

  Posted by: yblouin on October 02, 2007 at 09:59 AM

• Well, I just installed 10.5...

  Apple seems to have updated Java 5, but NO Java 6 !

  I looks like everyone is in the dark right now, not knowing anything about it...

  Posted by: martinm1000 on October 26, 2007 at 09:15 PM

• Ok, I switch back to vista, and by the way, buy a nokia cell phone and a sony MP3 player. Bye bye Apple, Max OS X and so on...

  Posted by: alpha1 on October 27, 2007 at 07:40 AM

• over a year since this post... wow, this is sad

  Posted by: bpartridge on December 13, 2007 at 06:31 AM

• Came out over this weekend. Unfortunately, so far, there is no browser support for Java applets. In addition the update is only for 64 bit Intel macs. I guess they are only concerned about XServe's application server performance.

  Posted by: johnnykapalua on April 30, 2008 at 11:49 AM

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