On IRC Mark Weillard suggested the following: But you might want to look into GWT (Google Web Toolkit) if you want to "script" in java through javascript. so, yeah, it lets you write a web app using "Java" source code. But in the end it's still participating in the walled garden of javascript-only.

Because it took ten years for all web browsers to support the same Javascript ? Embed JavaFX (script type="text/javafx") all you want. It'll take another five to ten years for all web browsers to support it. The wallet garden argument has nothing to do with reality. You can run all kinds of scripting languages in the browser, but nobody wants to maintain the sandbox technology and yet another scripting language just becomes yet another security hole. Chui's argumentation suffers from being to overly broad. He sound like one of those high IQ types who wants to solve everything using one language, one API, one computer and one programmer. In American they call this a “pipe dream”. Java.net is disconnected with reality. For every guy who knows Swing/Java there are a 1000 guys who know HTML/DOM/CSS/Javascript. Silverlight is only marginally important because Microsoft controls 90 percent of the desktop marked and is the company behind C#. JavaFX will ride the JRE in the same way AIR is riding Flash and PDF. So it's not irrelevant. The problem is that most Java developers don't know jack shit about developing user interfaces.

@janerik: agree. there're not many ui designers and sun is not adobe ;) anyway, the fact that the ajax to java guys ratio is 1000 to 1 is perfect - that's actually why i can earn more as java guy :) am just wondering from which community will sun grab designers :P because adobe is making programmers from designers and that's pretty straightforward way ;) jfx will have a hard time, unfortunately.

Thers is also a discussion of Chui's arguments on javalobby: [http://java.dzone.com/articles/questions-sun-over-javafx] He and I (cfagan) go back and forth on this, but he stopped posting my replies so the conversation ended. I'm not sure using a prerpocessor with JavaFX really gives buys you anything. What can you generate that you can't just write?

Can Flash be inlineable with HTML ? It don't think so. So, why inlining JavaFX with HTML ? At first sight, 'no', but it might bring opportunities, for example, if, similarly to GWT, JavaFX is compiled to HTML+JS. This being said, of course, there is a kind of race between HTML+JS versus other platforms. But while JS may gain more market, this language should become more complex to deal with complexity other languages are already facing. One example: doing AJAX request on client-side raises the thread race pb and then, AJAX frameworks have to deal with that pb. Another example: while AJAX scripts become longer, "programming in the large" raises pbs better resolved by using a typed language, at least, more typed than JS. And another point is that Java has a standard library and is more standard than JS (accross all the browsers). So, language market share evolution is still unclear. Looks like future is still open, and that's interesting.

I don't think there's been a call on the Web developer side for non-Javascript scripting. It's already extremely hard to get a Javascript application to behave the same across browsers. If the web browsers can't get that right, how is adding another language going to help? On the other hand, there's a lot to be said for the plug-in approach such as Adobe's Flash (yes, I know, boo hiss, but hey it works). You don't have to depend on the browser developer (especially Microsoft). Unfortunately then you have to convince all your users to install the plugin. Adobe does this by making it painless and as close to automatic as possible. Sun is making strides in that direction, but they're not quite there yet.

Oh, and yeah, "view source" doesn't work. That is NOT a feature. You want to hide your code, start your own internet. ;)