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Does Java have a bad reputation?

Posted by joshy on April 26, 2004 at 3:03 PM PDT

I recently read on Slashdot (something I promised myself I was
going to do less) about Miguel de Icaza's comments on Longhorn.
It was a pretty interesting read and makes me think I should read up
on XAML and Avalon, Microsoft's new technologies for making
advanced rich web applications. What struck me as particularly jarring,
however, was

this thread

where someone asked about Java as a webapplication stack to compete
with Microsoft or an as yet unwritten opensource toolkit. Most of the
readers jumped on this and attacked Java from all sides. What particularly
worries me was not that so many of these readers are opposed to Java, but
that their arguments are almost completely wrong. Take a look
at some of these comments:

Stock Java is not an option because it lacks a few
things: the easy-to-build functionality of a web
page (XAML) and the advanced graphics and rendering
of Avalon.

and this one:

However, it really does not matter what is going on in the java world. Java had its chance, and failed. Java the language has outgrown the Java the (virtual) machine. Java the language is now being extended in weak syntatic ways, think of generics where it is possible to corrupt generic containers because the support is only syntax deep.

and this one

Java is faster now, and computers are faster now, but technical analyses of .NET and the CLR tend to indicate that it is better thought out than Java. No wonder, since it came substantially later than Java, but that doesn't change the fact.

If Sun brings us a Java 3 in the near future which addresses these performance and scalability issues (among others) then this post will be irrelevant (well I guess it is already, welcome to slashdot right?) but right now it makes more sense to emulate the CLR and the non-Windows portions of .NET. Since Java is not open source, and the open source world would like to have something like Java but open, and .NET and the CLR are superior to Java (arguably anyway) why not implement .NET? If Microsoft changes their implementation to a point which destroys compatibility, there is still room for Mono to provide a cross-platform runtime environment which will run on Windows.

and this one

The main problem that I, personally, see with Java-based apps, is the non-native widget set. I have to admit, I honestly detest Swing/AWT stuff. Swing even more. Not only is the default theme ugly IMO, but even if you make it *look* like WinXP or Gtk or whatever, it doesn't *feel* like it.

and this one

Java is a minor cleanup of a horrible set of object oriented extensions of a 35 year old high level assembler.
Perl/Python/Eiffel/Tcl-Tk show what Java could have been and where it could have gone. Furthermore, even as a cleanup of C++ it got too many things wrong, as illustrated by the numerous minor bug patches in Java "the next generation", more commonly known as C#

And these were all comments that were rated 2 or higher.

I'm starting to really wonder why Java, or at least Java on
the desktop, has such an image problem? If you are talking about rich web enabled applications that run on your desktop and on the web, then Java should be at the top of the list. Do
we need a PR agent or something?

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